[Cialug] Windows Vista Preview

[Chris Hilton]

The things being done in Vista really are far beyond where Mac is:
1.)  .Net
2.)  WPF
I list .Net, because while people are content with objective-c, it's really 
not as advanced and is going to lack some of the more interesting features 
in .Net (linq for example).
I, personally, am not a huge fan of .Net; but it seems like it'll vastly 
improve Windows programming.

The bigger things are in WPF.  For one, widgets in WPF are entirely scalable 
and, supposedly, entirely repaintable.  You can make your widgets look vastly 
different and "pretty" while being enormously huge.
This doesn't matter for 99% of programs, but when you want to write that 
media-center code it sure makes it easier.  If people use it right it could 
be a good thing for scalable interfaces.  Ones which make sense on your PC, 
and on your tv, without any code modifications.
As far as graphics technology Microsoft is a little behind.  But not as far as 
most people think.  Comparing Quartz to WPF is a joke, it's little more than 
a compositor.  Compositors are nice but they're not nearly as interesting as 
pushing all your drawing onto the gpu as well.  But Quartz 2d Extreme is a 
pretty good comparison.

One place Microsoft is behind though is that their Windows Forms programs will 
be left drawn on the CPU in main RAM.  They'll be sorta like X11 programs on 
a Mac with 2d Extreme turned on.  Few people will notice, but I'll certainly 
want me 25MB of RAM back ;).

Just because they copy some interfaces doesn't mean they're behind the times.  
It'd be a painful mistake to pretend that Microsoft is somehow 
technologically lost...  They'd be better described as long between releases.

Things like spotlight and search all over the place are great.  It's not just 
Apple who's been doing it, and it's not just found on Apple's platform.  They 
don't own the idea of searching ;).  Nor do they own their simplistic 
buttonless approach.

I think we're coming into a new, bad, phase in graphical design where pretty 
graphics and spinning shiny balls win out over good intuitive designs and 
powerful software.
When Vista comes out Microsoft will be offering developers the easiest ways to 
make their programs shiny.  And they're porting a lot of it back onto XP...

If we laugh at them now they'll laugh last.  Remember laughing at Win95?  
It's sort of depressing really.

On Tuesday 10 January 2006 18:57, Tim Wilson wrote:
> On 1/10/06, Chris Hilton <chris129 at cs.iastate.edu> wrote:
> > They can't because they don't have a thousand (or so), of their best,
> > developers working on bringing in new developers and enchanting the ones
> > who are already there.
> > Microsoft exists for developers, and Microsoft remains because of the
> > programs those developers have written (stupidly enough in a non-portable
> > Microsoftian way).
> >
> >
> > Anyway, the article seemed like it was written by a snarling Machead too
> > obsessed with his own platform to realize that doing things right the
> > same way isn't just "copying," but it's doing things right the same way
> > ;). If Microsoft were truly copying Apple they'd dump .Net, stick with
> > c++ for 5 more years, drop most of their libraries including directX,
> > stop working on compatibility to keep their customers (developers) from
> > having to re-release, and start spending all their time on end-user
> > programs and interfacing. In reality their smartest people are working on
> > things like:  .Net, Singularity, NT Kernel, WPF (arguably copying Apple,
> > but also going farther than Apple plans).
> >
> > I really don't think Microsoft is copying Apple just because they copy a
> > few superficial features.  Who doesn't do that?
>
> The problem as I see it is a lot of people (Mr. Gates included) will
> paint Vista as "innovative", when it isn't.  I'm not a Mac head, don't
> own one, never have (but would like to).  I just find it funny
> Microsquish is so frequently behind the times.
>
> > If I seem annoyed it's because I really hate defending Microsoft.  Not
> > that what I've said here really paints them as anything but vile,
> > deceptive, and two-faced but in a much different (much smarter) way than
> > some people seem to realize.
> >
> > On Tuesday 10 January 2006 13:02, Nathan C. Smith wrote:
> > > If only Apple could steal the developers, developers, developers from
> > > MS.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Tim Wilson [mailto:tim_linux at wilson-home.com]
> > > Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2006 12:57 PM
> > > To: Central Iowa Linux Users Group
> > > Subject: Re: [Cialug] Windows Vista Preview
> > >
> > >
> > > Microsoft copy from Apple?  That's unheard of! :-)
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> > --
> > "The only winning move is not to play."
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> --
> Tim
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"The only winning move is not to play."