[Cialug] new to this group, and Linux
chris129 at cs.iastate.edu
chris129 at cs.iastate.edu
Thu Jun 2 13:59:50 CDT 2005
Trust me, it's better than being the computer mechanic with a family of computer
mechanics and former computer mechanics... At least when you say something,
you don't have to prove it!
Quoting Theron Conrey <theron at conrey.org>:
> chris129 at cs.iastate.edu wrote:
>
> >Most people solve your wife's problem by paying a mechanic $60 an hour
> (even
> >though the mechanic only gets maybe $20ish) ;). I'm not suggesting that by
> any
> >stretch though.
> >The only thing not elegant about installing Java and flash in a distro by
> >default is political; so that's not too big a deal. I'm surprised Mandrake
> >doesn't do this actually.
> >Maybe we'll see jre and flash autopackages soon!
> >
> >Quoting Theron Conrey <theron at conrey.org>:
> >
> >
> >
> >>I would agree with your first statement slightly revised:
> >>
> >>I'm correct but that doesn't make it right.
> >>
> >>My wife cares nought about the OS she only needs to accomplish tasks
> >>A,B, and C. She dosen't want nor need to learn anything else. When I
> >>buy a standard transmission toyota, I'd like to take the skills I've
> >>learned in operating that vehicle and believe that I can use the basics
> >>when learning to drive a standard lambourghini. The more different it
> >>is, the longer it takes me to learn how to use the car. That dosen't
> >>mean that I need to work "under the hood" to get it from point A to
> >>point "B". The fact is that the article (as are all good projects)
> >>requirement based. if a requirement is to have basic windows users
> >>comfortable with the system, the closer it looks to windows the
> >>likelyhood of it's success increases. Not saying that it's an ideal
> >>solution or an elegant one, just that it's the reality that's upon us.
> >>BTW, my wife thinks that if she needs to learn how to change the oil or
> >>adjust the timimg of a vehicle to drive, then she'd rather
> >>walk.............. It translate = to computers.....
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>chris129 at cs.iastate.edu wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>You're right, but that doesn't make it ok ;).
> >>>One: People who believe this should be exposed to the outside world.
> There
> >>>
> >>>
> >>was
> >>
> >>
> >>>a time when most people thought involuntary-debtless slavery was normal;
> >>>
> >>>
> >>that
> >>
> >>
> >>>never made it optimal, right, ok, truly legal, or anything else. This is
> >>>
> >>>
> >>not
> >>
> >>
> >>>such a big deal, after all it's just a computer not a human; but
> sometimes
> >>>
> >>>
> >>you
> >>
> >>
> >>>have to make drastic analogies to get people's attention.
> >>>My point is that it's very rude to come to someone and say: "Your
> product
> >>>
> >>>
> >>or
> >>
> >>
> >>>tool of choice is not good because it doesn't behave like the other
> >>>
> >>>
> >>product."
> >>
> >>
> >>>Like telling someone their Lambourghini is awful because it's a stick
> shift
> >>>
> >>>
> >>(if
> >>
> >>
> >>>I'm up to speed these only come in manual)...
> >>>
> >>>People should be willing to read and learn compact things (and how to
> >>>
> >>>
> >>execute
> >>
> >>
> >>>shells, and all other executables in unix is very compact) to get
> something
> >>>
> >>>
> >>new
> >>
> >>
> >>>or different.
> >>>
> >>>She is right about Java installs though, if your distribution doesn't do
> it
> >>>
> >>>
> >>for
> >>
> >>
> >>>you it is a very hairy process for the newb (although I've seen newbs do
> >>>it)...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Quoting Theron Conrey <theron at conrey.org>:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Not rude at all, because you've missed the point. His wife wants to use
> a
> >>>>computer that just works. Linux vs. Windows unimportant to the non
> techie.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>However if the only thing a non techie uses for work is windows, and you
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>have
> >>
> >>
> >>>>to live with that person and fix thier computer problems, it helps to be
> >>>>proficient. I am (nor the spouse of the author of that article) not a
> >>>>windows admin. or a user. So when things broke on my wife's laptop the
> >>>>beratment was severe since I earn a living as a "computer guy" and
> should
> >>>>know how to fix these "simple" problems. So when windows problems
> occured
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>I
> >>
> >>
> >>>>was the guy that had to fix it in my home.
> >>>>The issue is about 2 things:
> >>>>
> >>>>One: most computer users (emph. users) assume that all computers behave
> as
> >>>>windows does and when they don't thier broken. Nasty truth.
> >>>>Two: the guy want's to get his (and i did with mine) wife on a different
> >>>>platform so that I work less on fixing her computer. Saying that
> however
> >>>>does not imply anything about liking anything. It merely states that
> what
> >>>>the user is "used too" is windows, simply because thats all they've seen.
>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>Theron
> >>>>
> >>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>From: chris129 at cs.iastate.edu
> >>>>To: Central Iowa Linux Users Group <cialug at cialug.org>
> >>>>Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 11:16:07 -0500
> >>>>Subject: Re: Re: [Cialug] new to this group, and Linux
> >>>>
> >>>>Am I the only one who saw lots of characters on that page that don't
> exist
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>in
> >>
> >>
> >>>>my
> >>>>set? Lots of "A^" all over the place with an occasional epsilon...
> >>>>
> >>>>Anyway, the reviews are ok. But this part is a bit obnoxious:
> >>>>"Remember, I am the average Windows user and I want things to work just
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>like
> >>
> >>
> >>>>they would in Windows."
> >>>>Frankly, when people have that attitude I tell them the perfect "distro"
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>for
> >>
> >>
> >>>>them is Windows ;).
> >>>>Not to be rude, but if you like Windows you might as well use it!
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>Quoting Theron Conrey <theron at conrey.org>:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Adding to what is posted below there is a great article about different
>
> >>>>>distros and thier ease of use written by a Geeks spouse. Not saying
> that
> >>>>>it's a bad thing but similar articles helped my house (wife chose not
> to
> >>>>>veto) become free.
> >>>>>Theron
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I believe that this forum will snip me, but here goes
> >>>>>http://linux-blog.org/index.php?/categories/4-Reviews
> >>>>>
> >>>>>and if it does it's at the linux-blog.org site under reviews... Good
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>stuff.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Theron
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>>From: David Champion <dave at visionary.com>
> >>>>>To: Central Iowa Linux Users Group <cialug at cialug.org>
> >>>>>Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2005 22:55:34 -0500
> >>>>>Subject: Re: [Cialug] new to this group, and Linux
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Welcome to the list.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>FYI, there are Linux / Free Unix groups in Ames and Cedar Falls:
> >>>>>http://www.amesfug.org
> >>>>>http://www.cedarlug.org
> >>>>>
> >>>>>We should plan some joint meetings with AmesFUG for this summer!
> >>>>>Actually, stay tuned for an announcement for the June 15th meeting, I'm
>
> >>>>>guessing some of the Ames people may be interested in something we have
>
> >>>>>in the works.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>For you new users, here's my quick rundown of newbie friendly
> >>>>>distributions in order of friendliness:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Knoppix (bootable "live cd", no install needed)
> >>>>>Mandriva (was: Mandrake)
> >>>>>Ubuntu (has either a "live" cd or an installable CD)
> >>>>>Suse (the "free" version requires an FTP install, which is a pain)
> >>>>>Fedora (the free redhat)
> >>>>>Debian
> >>>>>....
> >>>>>Slackware
> >>>>>....
> >>>>>Writing your own distro from scratch
> >>>>>Gentoo
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I'm sure if you ask, someone will burn you a CD of the latest version of
>
> >>>>>any of those. I personally have the latest Mandriva 2005 LE (aka
> >>>>>Mandrake 10.2), and I have a bunch of the previous version of Ubuntu.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>p.s. :
> >>>>>We're supposed to be planning an Installfest, which would be handy for
> >>>>>all of these n00bs, but don't have a location or a date yet. Get on the
>
> >>>>>stick, you Installfest planners! Let me know if you need the contact
> >>>>>info for the Nevlyn Center in Ankeny.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>-dc
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Jim Asbille wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>On Wednesday 01 June 2005 17:45, Travis Beaty wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>I'm also fond of SuSE. I use 9.3, I purchased a copy for $12. I
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>started
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>with
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>Debian and then Red Hat but as a newbie I had trouble so I purchased
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>SuSE
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>9.0
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>which I heard had a great install and excellent out of the box hardware
>
> >>>>>>support. I'm hooked now because I'm getting better at using Yast and
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>I'm
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>comfortable with how well everything works.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>On Wednesday 01 June 2005 06:01 pm, albus wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Welcome Michael.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Hello All!
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Since we are introducing ourselves, I suppose it is time for me to
> come
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>out
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>of lurker mode and say "Hi!"
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I'm from the teeny weenie town of Osage, northeast of Mason City. I
> >>>>>>>signed up as I was out looking for lugs close to me -- there is only
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>one
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>that I am aware of which is closer to me than Des Moines.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>As far as my knowledge of Linux, I guess I would characterize myself
> as
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>on
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>the "high side of newbie." My story of how I was introduced to Linux
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>is
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>embarrassing and humorous, as I am probably the only person in the
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>known
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>universe who has ever *accidentally* installed Linux. This happened
> in
> >>>>>>>2000, and I was so impressed with what I saw, I've never gone back to
> >>>>>>>Windows. (FYI, it was Mandrake 7.2 that I installed.)
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>It's really embarrassing. My machismo commands me to shut up about
> it
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>now.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>At any rate, I would suggest looking at SuSE. I am now currently
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>running
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>9.2 on my laptop, and it is very nice. 9.3 is out, but I haven't
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>upgraded
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>yet, apart from installing KDE 3.4 on my system.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I'm sure there will be others that would argue pro or con about SuSE.
>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>And,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>that great! It's really a personal thing, what I've gained from my
> own
> >>>>>>>personal experiences with Linux. If [insert Linux distro here] works
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>for
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>you, that's super!! But keep in mind too that there are MANY high
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>quality
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>distros out there that are free, and very good.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Welcome to the Linux world. I think you will like it here!
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Regards,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Travis Beaty
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>P.S. At some point, I'll try to get to a meeting, but it is quite a
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>ways
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>to drive for me.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>Cialug mailing list
> >>>>>Cialug at cialug.org
> >>>>>http://cialug.org/mailman/listinfo/cialug
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>Cialug mailing list
> >>>>>Cialug at cialug.org
> >>>>>http://cialug.org/mailman/listinfo/cialug
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>Cialug mailing list
> >>>>Cialug at cialug.org
> >>>>http://cialug.org/mailman/listinfo/cialug
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>Cialug mailing list
> >>>>Cialug at cialug.org
> >>>>http://cialug.org/mailman/listinfo/cialug
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Cialug mailing list
> >>>Cialug at cialug.org
> >>>http://cialug.org/mailman/listinfo/cialug
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Cialug mailing list
> >>Cialug at cialug.org
> >>http://cialug.org/mailman/listinfo/cialug
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Cialug mailing list
> >Cialug at cialug.org
> >http://cialug.org/mailman/listinfo/cialug
> >
> >
> >
> unfortunatly in this house I'm the only computer mechanic... and I ain't
> getting paid....... insert jokes acordingly.
>
> T
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