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Matt,<br>
<br>
Considering that this is the *second* email Brian has sent regarding
hiring religious people, and the first email he sent included length
of contract details and wages, it appears that if this is illegal in
Iowa, he already crossed that line. That said, I believe the Federal
guidelines only apply to employers with more than 15 employees --
but I thought that the exempt employers had to include a standard
disclaimer stating that they are exempt from those guidelines. I am
not sure about any Iowa specific guidelines.<br>
<br>
Jeff<br>
<br>
On 3/6/2011 10:04 AM, Matthew Nuzum wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:AANLkTik3ZcAtsL9L5Y-FMOjXY_fgzBuwJ+BWM69Xjx-+@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 5:40 PM, Josh More
<span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:MoreJ@alliancetechnologies.net">MoreJ@alliancetechnologies.net</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
padding-left: 1ex;">
<div>
<div style="direction: ltr; font-family: Verdana; color:
rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13px;">
<div>However, the faith issue is a problematic one. I've
been thinking about it for hours, and I think I've
uncovered what the fundamental issue here is. Our group
is about open source software and open source ideals.
We tend to not directly discuss the ideals very often,
but they're there nonetheless. I think that what
bothered me the most about this wasn't the clear
faith-based slant, but the segmentation of society. I
believe that the intent here was to say that original
poster was willing to work on other projects, but is
unwilling to devote his personal time to someone that
does not share his personal beliefs. That's fine.
However, the "us vs them" where one side gets time and
support and the other side gets cash seems counter to
the inclusiveness of our group.<br>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
Josh, I think you've made the point pretty clearly here. It's
important to remember the context of this list. On Facebook or my
personal blog I share my opinions on a variety of topics,
including religious topics. On this list I share my opinions about
Linux (and you all know I'm opinionated). That's not to say that I
hide how I feel about those other topics; anyone who cares to know
more than my name will quickly know where I stand. But even if
"keeping it professional" isn't exactly a requirement for this
list, keeping it about Linux, open source or at least to the
technical fringes is a good policy. Especially in the
communication mediums that are archived for the world to see. [1]
<div>
<br>
</div>
<div>I think that Brian crossed a boundary here. I don't think
that putting your favorite bible verse in the .sig on your
e-mail is any more wrong than your favorite Franklin quote or
even your favorite Karl Marx quote. People on this list know
that that is the quiet, personal space where you can express
your individuality (keeping in mind [1] again of course).</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>However, lets say that the original e-mail were actually for
a hired position. That e-mail would certainly be deemed illegal
for most employers in Iowa. That alone makes it unprofessional.
I have worked for an organization who was legally allowed to
list certain religious views as a requirement and they did not
advertise in such a forward manner. It is simply asking for
people to be offended and make a commotion and ultimately, it
would not help them. In public job postings they listed the name
of their organization and their purpose clearly, so that no one
would be confused, and they clearly told potential applicants of
their special requirements and their special charter allowing
them to have these requirements personally during the first
contact.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>But most interesting, they did not usually advertise in such
a public place. Instead, they relied on word of mouth
advertising for help when they hired individuals or took on
contract work. In other words, they were discreet.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Here are a couple extra tips:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div> 1. Be very sensitive when posting things that look like job
posts</div>
<div> 2. Be even more sensitive when playing (or offering) the
role of head hunter</div>
<div> 3. Offensive words should be omitted. If you think someone
would be offended by a word, don't simply remove a letter and
pretend people won't be offended. I don't consider "Godly" to be
a swear word but Brian was apparently concerned and somehow
thought removing the letter "o" would be gentler. I think
instead it had the opposite effect.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As we get ready for politicians to begin their decent on Iowa
(as, many have) we need to remember that people we interact with
can often have very different views and perspectives in the
worlds of politics and religion. These two topics tend to get
people charged up more than about anything (except maybe
shameless promotion of the world's best code editor [2]).
Realize that e-mails on these subjects sent to the public
mailing list probably won't be on-topic (or will quickly be
taken off-topic) nor have any chance of swaying people's
opinions. The only probable outcome of mentioning either of
these two topics even casually will be to cause strife.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>And lastly, I've found it quite enlightening to expose myself
to people who have different perspectives on the world. Working
with people who's views vary from mine, and
when appropriate discussing them, has helped me better
understand and clarify in my own mind what and why I feel as I
do. I would strongly suggest that Brian would be best served by
looking for technical merit first and foremost and, I'm hoping
I'm not stepping out of bounds here, have faith that the right
candidate will surface.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>[1] <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://cialug.org/pipermail/cialug/">http://cialug.org/pipermail/cialug/</a></div>
<div>[2] Vim. Yeah, I said it.</div>
<div><br>
-- <br>
Matthew Nuzum<br>
newz2000 on freenode, skype, linkedin, <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://identi.ca" target="_blank">identi.ca</a>
and twitter<br>
<br>
"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest." -Benjamin
Franklin <br>
<br>
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